Devilish and false “Evangelical Community Church” in Hong Kong, in reality banned from fellowship a Christian who is absolutely innocent in relation to all excommunications by churches. Evangelical Community Church revealed its participation is a slanderous network of pastors of churches in Hong Kong.

(http://ecchk.org)

Evangelical Community Church in Hong Kong refused to welcome or to communicate with a Christian who is absolutely innocently in relation to all excommunications by churches.

Evangelical Community Church at first welcomed, and later changed it’s mind and hindered a Christian from fellowship. Evangelical Community Church pretended to want to help, but had no real intention to help.

Evangelical Community Church revealed its participation in a slanderous network of pastors in Hong Kong, who have sent secret text messages to each other to be aware of Torsten. Evangelical Community Church falsely explains their participation in a Hong Kong pastors’ slanderous network with a motive to make sure that newcomers are looked after “We wanna help each other out, and make sure that people that are entering are looked after.”, but in reality no church anywhere in Hong Kong welcomed the excommunicated Torsten to fellowship, which proves that the slanderous network of slandering Hong Kong pastors is precisely that: a slanderous network of pastors in Hong Kong who want to help themselves, but who do not help Torsten to enter a church fellowship. The slanderous network of Hong Kong pastors do not serve the purpose of helping, but only serves to unite the Christian churches against Torsten. Evangelical Community Church revealed that pastors of Hong Kong churches have secret issues against Torsten.

Falsehood, gossip, slander and lies is at the core of pastors of the English-speaking churches in Hong Kong.

---------------------

Time: Tuesday June 17, 2014 at 11:30

Location: agreed meeting at Ginger Café in Hong Kong

Audio file: 36 min, 3.4 MB, AMR-file

Josh Loke: Director of youth ministries at Evangelical Community Church in Hong Kong

Torsten Nenzén: visitor who is absolutely innocent to all excommunications by all churches

Link to the audio recording: www.kyrkor.be/Evangelical-Community-Church-Hong-Kong-Josh-Loke-2014-06-17-AMR.amr

A summary from minutes 31 to 35 of the audio recording pertaining to gossip and slander by Hong Kong pastors:

JOSH LOKE:   I have been contacted [by other pastors of other churches]

JOSH LOKE:   I am not unaware that some people have issues with yourself, and some people have looked you up on Google and things like that, so I am not unaware of that.

TORSTEN:   They contacted you to say what?

JOSH LOKE:   Just let me know that there is a person, a guy, asking around to visit different churches, and just to be aware of it.

TORSTEN:   Just to be aware of it?

JOSH LOKE:   The churches in Hong Kong are quite close. We wanna help each other out. We meet up to encourage each other.

You’re looking for a church base and just to be aware of it.

TORSTEN:   You have just revealed a network of slander among the church leaders, and I find that very disturbing.

JOSH LOKE:   I’m not sure I’ve revealed slander. It’s more we’re trying to be helpful.

TORSTEN:   I don’t think that’s very helpful. And I’m wondering what is the motive to say to watch out for this guy?

JOSH LOKE:   I didn’t say watch out, but to be aware, that there is someone looking for a home. I think it’s something to be very mindful of that churches in Hong Kong are united, and that we work together, we do ministry together, and that’s what God called for the churches to be; to be united in one thing. We wanna help each other out, and make sure that people that are entering are looked after.

TORSTEN:   How is that helpful? Watch out for this guy.

JOSH LOKE:   I didn’t say watch out but to be aware. Welcome him in when looking for a newcomer.

TORSTEN:   What precisely? Did they tell you or did they email you?

JOSH LOKE:   We “What’s Up”. It’s what we do. “What’s Up” – It’s like messaging.

TORSTEN:   Can you just tell me a little more about the nature of the content of that “What’s Up”?

JOSH LOKE:   I’m not gonna reveal what is privately communicated.

The email dialogue with Evangelical Community Church in Hong Kong is read chronologically from the bottom upwards beneath, with the most recent email at the top:

---------------------

Evangelical Community Church HK.

Hello,

In reality, has your church decided to ban me from participation in your small groups?

You ignored to answer my questions in relation to three specific statement:

- ONLY?: Is there not one single person in the late-20's in that group?

- MAINLY: Do none of these singles speak English?

- MOSTLY: Are there no singles in this group?

Please answer the questions up front.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Evangelical Community Church HK.

Hello,

In reality, has your church decided to ban me from participation in your small groups?

You ignored to answer my questions in relation to three specific statement:

- ONLY?: Is there not one single person in the late-20's in that group?

- MAINLY: Do none of these singles speak English?

- MOSTLY: Are there no singles in this group?

Please answer the questions up front.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Evangelical Community Church HK.

Hi Josh Loke,

Thanks for your response.

OK - my criteria were:

a) occasions of fellowship in your congregation

b) where ALSO single Christians

c) in the age bracket 30-39 (maybe also late 20’s)

d) gather and communicate

And you stated:

"none [of the groups] seemed to fit the criteria that you gave me"

It seems that you may be deciding for me beyond my stated criteria. I have never stated that I am uninterested in gathering and communicating with persons of Chinese culture. This is an exclusion entirely from your head.

And, let's look more closely at your words:

- "1 had [only?] singles under 23" {Is there not one single person in the late-20's in that group?}

- "2 were MAINLY chinese in culture and language" {MAINLY: Do none of these singles speak English?}

- "the Ho Man Tin group in our church is now MOSTLY comprised of young married couples" {MOSTLY: Are there no singles in this group?}

Maybe you are honest, but in light of your revelation to me that other pastors of local churches in Hong Kong are slandering me in a "What's Up" network and that you participate in such a network of slandering pastors, your credibility is clearly diminished. Whether you are honest or not, you are at the very least adding a selective criterium which do not belong in my stated criteria, and you appear to not be unmistakeably clear regarding your choice of words: MAINLY, MOSTLY etc.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Hi Torsten,

Wow, that's quite a harsh accusation, and while you're welcome to come to whatever conclusion you wish, I don't really think your statement is fair. If you recall from our conversation I said that indeed there were 4 young adults groups with mainly singles within, however 1 was for youth and young adult ministry leaders, 1 had singles under 23, and 2 were mainly chinese in culture and language, groups that I myself felt weren't for me.

Thus our church's website does very rightfully state that there ARE groups available, none seemed to fit the criteria that you gave me and as such I was looking into yet a 5th that might.They've changed their leadership and demographic since last I checked and as such it didn't work out.

You're welcome to believe what you will but I hope that you'll consider that I might actually have told you the truth and done the best that I could. Sorry to disappoint.

- Josh

Evangelical Community Church HK,

Josh Loke,

Has your church actually banned me from attendance in any of the groups where there also are single people? Is Evangelical Community Church stating that there is no group in your church where there are Christian singles attending, and is your church stating that there are no occasion for Christian singles to meet and communicate?

In having met and spoke with you, I found you to be rather sleek and false - somewhat like a used car salesman. Your email strengthens that impression. What you conclude in your email that there are no singles in your church, and your website (http://ecchk.org/#/community-groups), do not seem to correspond so well.

The impression is that Evangelical Community Church has decided to not welcome, and instead of saying so, you pretend that there are no occasions for singles to fellowship.

Shame on your church, and on your slandering network of pastards.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Hi Torsten,

Hope everything is going well with you, it's really hot outside, so make sure you drink lots of water + electrolytes during your street preaching. Heat stroke is not fun, had it once in China.

As I thought the Ho Man Tin group in our church is now mostly comprised of young married couples, so not really what you're looking for.

Sorry that I can't be of more help, and hope you enjoy the rest of your stay in Hong Kong!

- Josh

Josh Loke,

Hi,

I will be at the desired location tomorrow at 11:30 to meet you. If for some reason there would be a hindrance, then please send a text to inform me on: +46 707 77 77 54.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Hi Torsten,

Sorry I took so long to get back to you, Sunday is a busy day for churches! I completely understand about the background noise. Ginger has about 4 tables, and they're usually empty, so the noise is usually minimal. However we can check it out and if you're worried we can try to move it back to the office. Unfortunately we only have 1 conference room and I'm not sure if it's free.

So how bout we plan for Ginger at 11:30 this Tuesday and go from there?

- Josh

Josh Loke,

Hi,

Thanks for contacting.

Yes, 11:30 am on Tuesday June 17 will work. However, I will prefer a quiet place for the meeting with you. A café with background noise would not work so well. I appreciate from your email text that you seem to be an easygoing and benevolent person, but I have learned the necessity to take precautions when meeting church leaders, and therefore, I would like to meet you in a quiet environment where I can record our conversation. This is for my protection, but likewise, it could equally be for yours.

I understand that a change of environment away from the church office would be enjoyed by you. Is there a meeting room somewhere that you know of where we can talk undisturbed by background noise?

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Hi Torsten,

My name is Josh Loke, Youth Director and Interim Home Groups Director of ECC. Pastor Randy has told me that you're looking for a Home Group, that's great! We really believe in the power of Christian community here, and I look forward to helping you plug into the best group for you. He's asked me to meet with you to facilitate that process since you don't yet know anyone at the church who can invite you along to their group, but that's fine, we get dozens of new people every month, so I'm happy to help. He also mentioned that felt a bit misunderstood by his e-mails, so you wanted to record the meeting? I'm totally fine with that as well.

Unfortunately I can't make Monday morning as I have another appointment, however I'd be happy to meet with you at 11:30 on Tuesday morning? Also I was thinking somewhere semi public where you could feel more at ease, plus our church office is a bit boring, especially for me. There's a nice cafe that I like to meet people at along Johnston Road, number 55, called Ginger Bakery. Would that work for you?

If so please let me know sometime in the next couple of days and I can arrange to meet you there, looking forward to meeting you!

- Josh

Evangelical Community Church in Hong Kong.

Hello Lead Pastor Randal K. Young,

First of all, let’s get a fact straightened out. There is no basis whatsoever for your absolutely incorrect statement “You wanted to go to a home group without going to the worship services.”

Secondly, you did not ask me any further questions.

Thirdly, I will accept your condition to meet first with your appointed leader so that your leader may decide approval or rejection about my permission to communicate with other Christians, if you accept my condition for such a meeting. My condition for accepting to meet your leader privately is that I audio record the entire conversation with your leader – for my personal protection.

Are you willing to submit to this condition? If so, then please arrange a meeting with your leader. I am available for such a meeting on one of the mornings in the beginning of next week. I suggest Monday morning June 16 at 10 am in one of the church offices.

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Dear Torsten,

I want you to meet with a church leader first because of the uniqueness of your approach to our home groups. First, you wanted to go to a home group without going to the worship services, where home group leaders could ordinarily meet you and place you in a suitable home group. Second, you mentioned in your email that other churches have Googled you and excommunicated you. That is highly unusual and raises red flags. We have a responsibility to protect the brothers and sisters, and therefore we want to know who you are first. That is why we want to meet with you first. Are you willing to submit to this? If so, then a church leader will contact you to meet with you.

Pastor Randy

Evangelical Community Church.

Hello Randy,

As my initial letter to your church stated in its first sentence "I am a Christian here in Hong Kong." Therefore, yes, I am in Hong Kong now.

Since you ordered me to "not go to any groups yet" but to "meet with a church leader first" I am therefore of course somewhat reluctant to visiting your worship services, yet.

Can you please explain why you do not want me to communicate with other Christians yet, and why you demand that I must meet with a church leader first?

It should be rather obvious that persons who are selectively discriminated and requested to be approved by a church leader first, would be less inclined to seek mutual relationships with such a community. The mere demand of screening for allowance to communicate with others is demeaning, and does not indicate my sought mutuality of relationships.

Was there something that you wanted to know? Did you have a question that needed an answer?

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Dear Torsten,

Do not go to any groups yet. Instead, please meet with a church leader first. Are you in Hong Kong now, and are you planning to come to any of the worship services this Sunday?

Pastor Randy

Evangelical Community Church

www.ecchk.org

+852 27234777

Evangelical Community Church.

Hello Randy,

Please respond to my enquiry.

Am I welcome to the two suggested groups. If I am welcome, then what are the time & location of those meetings? How do I contact their group leader?

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Evangelical Community Church.

Dear Randy,

Thanks for responding to my enquiry.

I would be interested to fellowship with the two English-speaking groups that meet on Fridays and Saturdays.

Also, thanks for asking me to provide information to you directly. Please feel free to ask specific questions if you have. Most church leaders simply search my name in a webbrowser search engine and subsequently excommunicate me, or they speak with slandering and lying denominational colleagues and excommunicate me. Your approach so far is a correct one -- you ask questions.

Facts:

- I am a single (never-married) Christian man.

- I became a Christian at age 13, renewed my Biblical understanding of water baptism at age 19, and was later filled/empowered by the Holy Spirit.

- I am, especially as a never-married single, at an age of increased sensitivity regarding revelation of my age.

- I seek to meet other single Christians in their 30's (or late 20's).

Regards,

Torsten Nenzen

Dear Torsten,

We do have many groups. In fact, we have around 5 or so different groups that might fit what you are looking for (single, age 30's). Two of them meet in Wan Chai on Friday nights (English), one meets on Saturday afternoons (English), and then we have one or two groups on Sundays that are in Tagalog. Could you give me a little background about yourself? Just need a little information about your age, and how long you've been a Christian. Any other information would be helpful. I could refer you to the leaders of these groups.

Pastor Randy

Evangelical Community Church

www.ecchk.org

+852 27234777

Hi Torsten,

I'm Mark, the director of Filipino Ministries of ECC. I trust that one of my fellow staff or Pastor Randy himself responded to your letter. Yes, there are community groups which you may consider joining one. Maybe one nearest your place.

May I know what nationality are you? Our Filipino Sunday group joins the first service, after which we have our different activities at Wan Chai Ministry Center. But we don't have gatherings on weekdays other than Saturday.

We can meet somewhere if you want.

In Christ,

Mark

Dear Torsten,

Thank you for your email.

You are welcome to attend our church services and you can also connect with a home group. There are multiple groups that fit into your age bracket and you are welcome to try them out to see which fits your needs and schedule better. Please check out our website for brief introductions of the different groups that meet throughout the week and in various locations in Hong Kong.

http://www.ecchk.org/#/community-groups

If there is a specific group you would like to visit, do let us know by reply email (I have copied our homegroups coordinator/ liaison on this email) and we'll be more than happy to introduce you and connect you with the respective group leader.

Are you attending any of our worship service? Please do look for us after the service so that we can also meet you in person.

Kind regards,

Jeannie Wong

Director of Operations

Evangelical Community Church Ltd

Phone: +852 2723 4777

Direct: +852 2732 7301

www.ecchk.org

Dear Evangelical Community Church HK,

Hi.

I am a Christian here in Hong Kong. I seek a Christian community in Hong Kong where I might find opportunities to fellowship, socialise, meet and talk with also Christian singles.

Are there occasions of fellowship in your congregation where also single Christians in the age bracket 30-39 (maybe also late 20’s) gather and communicate? Are there fellowship groups, community groups, cell groups or small groups in your church that I can attend and develop friendships?

Best regards,

Torsten Nenzén

Email: torsten@nenzen.net